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The Nonmen Quya (spoilers) posted 14 Feb 2006, 02:02 by Twayleph, Auditor

Hi Scott, I have a few questions regarding the Quya in light of what we've learned from TTT. The Quya are a sorcerer-caste of the Nonmen, whose sorcery is about as deadly as the Gnosis. We've also learned that the Quya forbade the use of the Aporos. So what prevented the Quya from utterly dominating Nonmen society ? It's been said several times that, if it weren't of the Chorae, sorcerers would have come to rule the Three-Seas. Well before the Cuno-Inchoroi Wars there weren't any Chorae, so what prevented the Quya from taking over? Perhaps they already did dominate, but then why would there be a distinct Ishrol caste and a Quya caste, if Quya and Nonman noble are the same? Perhaps the Quya's dominance is blunted because their warriors are so formidable in combat, but then the same could be said of their sorcerers. Also, now that there are thousands of Chorae in the world, have the Nonmen resigned themselves to their existence and started accumulating their own Chorae hoard, or do they still spurn all things Aporos? view post

Re: The Nonmen Quya (spoilers) posted 14 Feb 2006, 03:02 by Entropic_existence, Moderator

[quote="Twayleph":1ljum2x0]Hi Scott, I have a few questions regarding the Quya in light of what we've learned from TTT. The Quya are a sorcerer-caste of the Nonmen, whose sorcery is about as deadly as the Gnosis.[/quote:1ljum2x0] Just wanted to point out at the Quya are Gnostic Sorcerors. It was the Non-men who taught the Gnosis to the Gnostic schools of the Ancient North. view post

posted 14 Feb 2006, 03:02 by Twayleph, Auditor

I should've been more precise; I meant the human version of the Gnosis. It's true that the Quya taught the humans the Gnosis, but since the end of the Tutelage the sorcery of the Gnostic Schools and the Quya have become slightly different (for instance, in TTT Mekeritrig uses a "Quya variant" of a Thawa Ligature). What I meant was that, even though the two sorceries weren't identical, the Quya's sorcery (as practised in the days before the Tutelage) should still be similar in power to the Gnosis used by the Mandate - which is formidable, and should be more than powerful enough to dominate the mundane factions of a society. view post

posted 14 Feb 2006, 18:02 by Entropic_existence, Moderator

Gotcha Twayleph, and you're absolutly right.. I'm also interested in the reply to this, we know the Warrior-Caste had quite a bit of power and the Quya seemed quite respected as well, so I wonder if there is some sort of social/religious stigma placed on Sorcery by the Non-men as well. It would make sense if there was, the fact that the Few can spot the Onta, and how... ugly the Onta can be I would speculate some negativity to become associated with it. view post

posted 14 Feb 2006, 20:02 by Twayleph, Auditor

[quote:h10om8pm]I wonder if there is some sort of social/religious stigma placed on Sorcery by the Non-men as well.[/quote:h10om8pm] Yes, I agree that religion might have something to do with this situation, although my intuition is that Nonmen, to the contrary of Men, might believe sorcery to be [i:h10om8pm]sacred[/i:h10om8pm], in a sense. But that's little more than speculation on my part. I'm all the more interested in the answer to that question, now that you've brought up it might be tied to the Nonmen's notion of worship. Unfortunately, I fear that might be exactly the reason why we [i:h10om8pm]won't[/i:h10om8pm] get an answer from Scott...:) view post

posted 17 Feb 2006, 16:02 by Cu'jara Cinmoi, Author of Prince of Nothing

I would love to answer these questions, Twaleph, but they involve what I think are some of the juicier info-morsels in AE. I almost feel ashamed to say this, but I designed the TTT glossary to be as much as teaser as anything else. Old habits die hard, I suppose... view post

posted 17 Feb 2006, 17:02 by Twayleph, Auditor

Ah well, at least you prepared us for it...Like Conphas said, answers are like opium, and with a glossary that takes up a hundred pages...definitely count me addicted ! But really, all my questions were AE-spoilers? Even the Chorae one? I like the implications of that....;) view post

posted 28 Feb 2006, 14:02 by Cu'jara Cinmoi, Author of Prince of Nothing

All I can say is that AE will put the [i:3m8kqgly]whole[/i:3m8kqgly] world into play. :twisted: view post

posted 28 Feb 2006, 14:02 by Entropic_existence, Moderator

By whole world does that include Eanna? :) view post

posted 15 Mar 2006, 18:03 by Cu'jara Cinmoi, Author of Prince of Nothing

Why is everyone so curious about Eanna all of a sudden? view post

posted 15 Mar 2006, 18:03 by Edge of Certainty, Subdidact

you just had to go and write that the one little word in the far right corner of the map, didn't you. If you just marked it as "unkown lands" it would be much more intriguing and, possibly, we woulda left it at that, but you [i:1yvjto23]had[/i:1yvjto23] to go and name it and then give us a micro-sliver of it's history. By the way, do the Xiuhianni have any sorcery of their own and would you describe it as gnostic of anagogic? lol, just kidding. view post

posted 15 Mar 2006, 20:03 by Entropic_existence, Moderator

Personally I blame my problem on being addicted to the world building behind the series I really love. Something about completely sinking in to a realm of fantasy is highly appealing. view post

posted 27 Mar 2007, 19:03 by Madness, Peralogue

I know this topic is just over a year old, I just thought to resurrect it as it has some of my personal favorite Cu'jara Cinmoi quotes. As well, I thought to rectify a misconception within the post concerning Twayleph's original comments. [quote="Cu'jara Cinmoi":ofv01owo]The Siqu need not be Quya, though they could be. The ability to see and work sorcery is heritable, though far less so in Men than in Nonmen. The Quya are in fact hereditary sorcerers.[/quote:ofv01owo] view post

posted 28 Mar 2007, 12:03 by Twayleph, Auditor

I liked that discussion as well. Which misconception are you referring to, though ? This quote refers to the Siqu - which I don't see how they concern this discussion - and mentions that the Quya are a hereditary caste of Nonmen sorcerers, which I had mentionned (except the part that their caste is hereditary). view post

posted 28 Mar 2007, 16:03 by Madness, Peralogue

In this thread above, and elsewhere in the forums, whenever a poster refers to Nonmen Magi they constantly seem to refer to them solely as Quya. The misconception I'm referring to is just that; Nonmen sorcerers need not be Quya. I could have quoted only the end of the above passage, as it was the only relevent part to my point. The reason I point this out, aside from my absurd wish for posts to be fanatically accurate, is that I think the issue will be rather important later; specifically, the fact that the ability to work sorcery is more heritable in Nonmen than Men. It raises some interesting questions, especially if Kellhus's assertions of sorcery prove correct. That in itself is material for another discussion, however, as I maintain a view of Kellhus as Dunyain until near the end of The Thousandfold Thought. view post

posted 28 Mar 2007, 18:03 by Twayleph, Auditor

Ah, I see now. But I think all Nonmen magi are indeed Quya, as supported by the definition in the TTT dictionnary : [quote:1or9u3b3]Quya - The generic name for Nonmen Magi[/quote:1or9u3b3] Siqu isn't another caste of Nonmen, it was simply the title given to Nonmen advisors to mankind during the Tutelage, if I remember correctly. The question of why some individuals belong to the Few and others don't [i:1or9u3b3]is[/i:1or9u3b3] fascinating; I still find it hard to understand why it would be hereditary, per example, given what we've learned in TTT. A good subject for a new thread in the TTT forum perhaps :) view post

posted 28 Mar 2007, 19:03 by Madness, Peralogue

Indeed, Twayleph. Furthering my interest the actual The Thousandfold Thought entry reads as follows: [b:22kb64dd]Siqu[/b:22kb64dd]: Generally, the term referring to Nonmen who find themselves in the service of Men, usually as [i:22kb64dd]mercenaries[/i:22kb64dd] or in some advisory capacity. Specifically, those Nonmen who participated in the so-called Nonmen Tutelage from 555 to 825. However, despite The Thousandfold Thought excerpt on Quya, I find it interesting that Cu'jara Cinmoi would make a point to write of Quya as hereditary sorcerers. Think of the following: Nonmen society is old and was vast long before the Norsirai nations or any nation of Man. Now, translate the generational inheritance of the Dunyain into terms of Nonmen and sorcery and your left with an astounding revelation; the Quya. Some more food for thought concerning sorcery. As we read in one of Iyokus's narratives, sorcery is as a giant labyrinth. There are innumerable paths, doors, grottos, caverns and avenues one can explore in the great labyrinth of sorcery. He does not begrude the Mandate the Gnosis because the Scarlet Spires holds possession of the Daimos. The only insight to a Nonmen religious viewpoint we have concerns agencies. We know that the Nonmen sorcerers are responsible for the Aporos and the Gnosis. Is it not more than likely then that Nonmen sorcerers and Quya have uncovered many diverse sorceries? view post


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