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dusted off in read-only

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posts by OsRavan Commoner | joined 18 Jan 2006 | 2


posted 18 Jan 2006, 03:01 in Literature DiscussionA Game of Thrones by OsRavan, Commoner

I'm a huge huge martin fan. Read the series well over 50 times. And I have to say theres *tons* to be picked up on rereads if you keep your eyes open. In fact, imo its one of the subtlest books out there. Some possible spoilers here if oy uahvnt read the series as i point out some good reread things... Rhaegar and lyanna first off as someone mentioned if a big theory. ie R + L = J. And i think the evidence actually points pretty strongly to lyanna not being raped by rhaegar but them eloping together. Specialy in asos you get lots of hints of this. Read the Reeds story of the tournament in Harrenhall as an example. its a metaphor that tells us alot. Read the variouse ocmments on rhaegards honor etc. hes jsut not the raping sort of character. Indeed. NEd often thinks quite fondly of Rhaegar. Something highly unlikely to occur if Rhaegar had raped his beloved sister. Not to mention you have to ask why was lyanna dying on a bed of blood if not due to childbirth. Its nto the after effects of a rape.. shes been with rhaegar for months by this point. And Rhaegars been dead for a good while too. So whats killing her? Not to mention why are there 3 of the kings gaurd with her? As the TOJ exchange reveals, the trident could have had a very differnt end if those 3 had been at Rhaegars back. Why werent they? The explanation you pick up.. from asos and feast... is that rhaegar was convinced his son.. jon.. was the prince who was promised. We know (feast spoilers here) that at first Rhaegar thought of himself as the prince who was promised... ie he comes to that conclusion while reading in his fathers library. And the discovery of the prophecies convicnes him he must be the PWWP. LAter however, we see how he changes his mind (the dragon must have three heads) and decides it must be one of his *sons* who will be the PWWP. Maester Aemon now thinks its dany.. due to a msitranslation (ie they translated it as masucline which it wasnt necccecerly) However, seeing as he thinks rhaegars onyl son is dead (and hence cant be the pwwp) there is still some doubt as to who is the real PWWP. However... before we get off track... I atleast would argue that while no one has out and out said jon is the son of rhaegar and it wasnt rape.. its pretty darn clear if you look for the subtle hints. Other things to pick up on rereads you mgiht not have grasped at first glance. Loras and Renly being lovers. You can raise the quesiton of just who *is* the PWWP. Stannis? Jon? Dany? all sorts of subtle hints. looks at the prophecys. Theres tons of them. Wh a re the three heads of the dragon? I say Tyrion, Jon, Dany. You know why? Her Three betrayles? did you pick up on who white bear was right away? One interesting thing i picked up. The horn of winter is not the one mance thinks he has, but the one sam has. Anotheri nterestign thing to pick up, is ColdHands Benjen stark? (dont buy that myself) Was Syrio really a faceless man.. and the same person as jaquen (I say yes) Was it a faceless man who killed Balon Greyjoy? (again i say yes) for those of you who have read feast.... some big spoilers here Did you pick up who the sphinx really is? Hint. He is not a he. Did you pick up that 'the alchemist' is really a faceless man? Did you pick up that the hound is still alive? That the mountain has been turned into a franken monster? That Davos is really alive? The list really goes on and on. Before feast came out, the GRRM board was able to predict with alot of accuracy the events of the next book for isntance. Taht arya would be trained in the free cities. That sansa would be tutored by LF. so on. btw did you all pick up on the red wedding hints in book 2? Did you get all the dany prophecys in the house of the undying? Do you get the signifigance of Sansa's wolf being dead? All the refernces to aryas wolf? Do you know which characrer in the book is descended form Duncan the tall? Honesty, I can go on and on. And we havnt even touched on the subtler character growths, only on hidden plot points. theres just as much character detail to be picked up. Does stannis know he kileld his brother? The signifigance of stannis sword not having heat. Of Craster sacraficing his babies to become others. Stannis hismelf is a complex character. Look at his treatment of Proud Wing. Theres tons to be gained from character study in rereads. Theres shocking depths to alot of these characters. Even the ones that seem shallow.. such as the Blackfish and Loras.. you gain new isnight to in rereads. And lets not even touch Cat and LF and Cercie and Jaime lol. Or Tywin. The fact that he used ot sneak out of the castle of the hand to visit whores. On and on and on. I think you get the idea. I dont get people who say theres nothing to be gotten in rereads. I coudl reread these books till the end of time, and still pick up hitertoo unnoticed character depths. Like I said, ive reread them mroe then 50 times, and i still feel i learn new angles and depths to the characters with each reread. view post


posted 18 Jan 2006, 03:01 in Book ClubA Game of Thrones book club discussion open by OsRavan, Commoner

i'll add i dont think arya was supposed to be badass so much as psycho. I mean she clearly has her limits. shes not some super powerfull warrior, which is what i like. When you strip it down, shes just a confused, scared, lonely girl. view post


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